Chapter Tactics #52: Analyzing the Last 3 Codices and Their Meta Impact

Chapter Tactics is a 40k podcast which focuses on promoting better tactical play and situational awareness across all variations of the game. Today PeteyPab, Incontrol, and Abusepuppy go over the meta impact that the Chaos Daemons, Blood Angels, and Dark Angels codices will have on the LVO and beyond.

Show Notes:

  • If you are one of the individuals whose situation is relevant to my opening message, try giving this phone number a call (1-800-273-8255), or click here for more information. Or you can just email me, i’m always open for some good heart to heart chatting.
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  • Chapter Tactics is back! With Weekly episodes and a lot of tactical insight, this is your place for all things 40k in 8th edition.
  • Check out the last episode of Chapter Tactics here. Or, click here for a link to a full archive of all of my episodes.
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  • Intro by: Justin Mahar

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About Petey Pab

Aspiring 40k analyst, tournament reporter and Ultramarines enthusiast, Petey Pab only seeks to gather more knowledge about the game of 40k and share it with as many people as he can in order to unite both hobbyists and gamers. We are, after all, two sides of the same coin.

31 Responses to “Chapter Tactics #52: Analyzing the Last 3 Codices and Their Meta Impact”

  1. rvd1ofakind January 15, 2018 12:31 am

    I’d really like some pics of tables with “good terrain”. Just to see if we’re putting on enough of it.

    • Commader_Sune January 15, 2018 2:18 pm

      That would be great. FLG should make a video about setting up terrain in 8th ed.

  2. rvd1ofakind January 15, 2018 1:02 am

    @geoff I noticed that “can you though?” !!! You just can’t stop, can you 😀

  3. rvd1ofakind January 15, 2018 1:11 am

    Khorne Lord of Skulls has the Daemon FACTION keyword. So it can still deepstrike.
    Same with Obliterators, which means I can put both of them into a Chaos Daemons detachment without breaking it?

    • abusepuppy January 15, 2018 1:25 am

      I mean, Obliterators already have the ability to deep strike, so if you want to throw away 2CP, then sure.

      But yes, both of them have the Daemon faction keyword (in addition to Heretic Astartes), and thus are allowed to be part of a Daemon detachment. You obviously need to pick the appropriate , of course.

      • rvd1ofakind January 15, 2018 1:41 am

        Well that’s why I mentioned them seperatelly. LoS for deepstrike and obliterators (and LoS) for detachment.

        But that’s really weird. Why those 2 units only. Why are they not in the codex then? GW…..

        • abusepuppy January 15, 2018 9:32 am

          The Lord of Skulls, in 7th edition, was a unit available to both CSM and to Chaos Daemons. Presumably that is why it has the Daemon faction.

          I don’t know why Obliterators do. I don’t understand a lot of the choices GW makes, to be honest.

    • Blight1 January 15, 2018 7:23 am

      Did they change that from the index?

      • rvd1ofakind January 15, 2018 8:26 am

        Huh. They did. Now that’s super weird.

  4. Lincroyable January 15, 2018 4:54 am

    Thanks for the podcast. Good to hear about demon faction FAQ coming.
    I wonder following what was said about codex like BA or DW that kind of charge forward and get stuck in the opponent screen and get shot to death next turn. If you use jump packs, can’t you just jump over the screen? cause I have in mind some combos that are based on this principle but if I got it wrong please correct me. Of course this requires as well that the opponent leaves ‘holes’ between the screen and key strategic units, big enough spaces to jump in a unit. But if this mechanic works, I feel that the BA stratagem that allows you to move a unit before the first player turn and after deployment is one of the strongest around.

    • Petey Pab
      Petey Pab January 15, 2018 9:16 am

      Hey man!

      You totally can, the problem is not very many players leave you that oppurtunity these days. I wouldn’t bank on a strategy that requires my opponent to make a mistake. The best thing you can do to stop from being shot at is to surround a single surviving model so it can’t escape and hope your opponent passes morale.

    • abusepuppy January 15, 2018 9:37 am

      I think that stratagem (Forlorn Fury) is very strong, as I mention in the podcast. However, it’s very hard for an entire army to ride on one or two tricks, unless they are _incredibly_ good tricks. I can’t speak with certainty, but I have the feeling that BA will suffer from a number of the problems that we discuss in the podcast.

      And yes, they can potentially jump over screens- but that does require much longer charge rolls in most castes, and it means needing to declare additional charge targets (and absorb additional overwatch), and it is contingent on your opponent placing their models in such a way that you can get to them.

      But more than that, it means that you still have to arrive more than 9″ away from enemy units (if you came in through reserves), and you still can’t declare charges against targets more than 12″ away from you, which is going to limit what you’re able to get to in many situations. The Fly keyword will get you past weaker screens, but as we discussed you NEED to have good ways to break through screens of all sorts- and that includes stuff like units of 30 Gaunts, etc. It’s a critical part of 8E in many matchups.

  5. Ryan Sandwich January 15, 2018 9:02 am

    So sorry to hear about your friend. Thanks for including the message at the beginning and the resources. Be excellent to each other.

    • Petey Pab
      Petey Pab January 15, 2018 9:09 am

      Thanks man, that means a lot. I was a little worried, I wasn’t sure how you guys would react, but so far i’ve gotten overwhelming positivity. Which is awesome.

      • lockinfinity January 15, 2018 12:27 pm

        Keep doing what you do! Your message was definitely heard.

  6. iNcontroL January 15, 2018 3:48 pm

    hope you guys enjoy! Was fun to discuss this stuff.

  7. Icoop January 15, 2018 3:56 pm

    @abusepuppy regarding Slaanesh deamons; I think we’ll all be more surprised if they didn’t get a release with Emperors Children & Fulgrim next fall, like TS/Tzeentch and DG/Nurgle the last two falls.

    • abusepuppy January 15, 2018 11:20 pm

      Honestly? I don’t think they’re going to. I wouldn’t rate it as impossible, but Nurgle, Tzeentch, and Khorne have all gotten a lot of attention on various fronts, but never Slaanesh. I do expect that they will eventually put out models to replace the current Finecast Fiends, Noise Marines, and Keeper of Secrets, but I don’t see any good reason to expect that will be anytime soon- they could easily run for several more years or longer off the resin molds.

      Slaanesh is the whipping boy of the Daemon faction; GW has always given them mediocre releases, and I think it’s reasonable to expect that they will continue to do so. I would absolutely love to see a big, splashy Emperor’s Children + Slaanesh Daemons release (since EC is one of my main armies), but I’m not holding my breath for it. Thousand Sons and Death Guard both have their own codices- Emperor’s Children do not.

      • rvd1ofakind January 15, 2018 11:42 pm

        To be fair, World eaters don’t have one either

        • abusepuppy January 16, 2018 7:54 am

          That’s true- I wouldn’t expect to see a big World Eaters release, either, but Berzerkers at least have a plastic kit (even if it is badly in need of an update.)

          I think if you compare the number of Khornate kits with the Slaaneshi ones, however, you’ll see the huge disparity.

      • Icoop January 16, 2018 7:30 am

        That’s really surprising to hear from you. Two summers ago TS and DG both only had a single(old mold) cult unit and FC Champions. They can only support their own codexes because of the last two fall Chaos releases. Also two summers ago Tz and Nu only had old mold Greater Deamons. As Khorne got a plastic champion(KHÂRN) and plastic greater deamons before that they really have no place to go but Slaanesh. Also relevant that the three antagonists to Reboot in the fluff have been Magnus, Mortarion and Fulgrim. The fluff of last year’s AOS board game was a Slaanesh champion on a quest of finding The Dark Prince. I’m fairly certain the Khorne plastics came around the time the AOS Khorne models, I know Tzeentch mortals and Nurgle mortals did. They have to have neglected someone in order to release others in the manner with which they’re releasing things (here’s all of this one thing at once!). I mean realistically anything can happen but the trend for the last few years has been this.

        • abusepuppy January 16, 2018 8:00 am

          That’s true for TS and DG, sure… but Nurgle and Tzeentch have always both had far, far greater support than Slaanesh ever has. Tzeentch has about as many troop models to its name as Slaanesh has entire units (Brims, Blues, Pinks, Rubrics, Tzaangors vs Daemonettes, Chariot, Fiend, Seeker, Noise, and Keeper.)

          As I said, it’s not impossible that Slaanesh will get a release.. but historically, they have almost never been so blessed, and I’m not expecting that to change. I would love to see a huge, fancy Keeper of Secrets with rules that aren’t awful, but Slaanesh is easily the weakest of the four gods in the current codex and gets the worst of everything except the Locus.

        • Tomguycot January 16, 2018 10:58 am

          I’m with Abusepuppy on this. I think the chances of Emperor’s Children and especially Slaaneshi daemons getting a substantial update are pretty low. Based on the general neglect that EC and Slaanesh get in 40k and the marginalization Slaanesh has received in AoS I think it’s fair to speculate that GW is not really sure what to do with Slaanesh as the “battle strippers” asthetic is not exactly in line with what GW trying to do with 40k. I mean just look at the new Death Guard models and paint scheme and it is a very different look than they’ve had in the past.

  8. CWDub January 15, 2018 8:46 pm

    Very classy intro message, Petey Pab.

    Only about 1/3rd of the way through, but I’m really enjoying iNcontrol/AbusePuppy riffing off each other. Good choices there fam!

    • Petey Pab
      Petey Pab January 15, 2018 8:53 pm

      Thanks man, that means a lot.

  9. Jeremy Veysseire
    MikhailLenin January 16, 2018 2:01 pm

    The Downfall of Ravenwing Armies is Ruins with Levels and LoS Blocking walls. Can’t Charge, cant move through, hopefully the objective isn’t in it.

  10. Doty January 16, 2018 7:01 pm

    hey guys I just wanted to say that I enjoyed the episode, & really appreciated the mental health awareness piece–even if people don’t have health insurance; there are M.H. professionals out there willing to discount their sessions for those looking for help, up to/& including seeing people for free, until they can get up on their feet again. The healthcare system is frankly a mess in many countries, & even those that pour a ton of resources into it (e.g. The USA) there are sadly deserts/gaps in coverage/support in rural areas, but if you look, there are people out there on the phone or online willing to listen, & help provide perspective & support.

  11. Doty January 16, 2018 7:06 pm

    Also, what Imperium factions make the best allies for Astra Militarum allies? Are some better aid for Catachans, while others help Cadians more?? I have my thoughts, but would love to hear what people more ‘in the know’ than me think, even if the ol’ Guard is a relatively well-rounded book.

    • abusepuppy January 16, 2018 7:26 pm

      I would say that two of the best allies for IG are Sisters of Battle (for Celestine, Seraphim, and Dominions in Repressors) along with Space Marines (for Scouts, melee characters, Null Zone, and miscellaneous support.) As Pablo mentions in the show, having a strong melee unit that you can advance into the center of the field and hide in a ruin is very powerful and can really swing a game- you need that kind of mobility and threat in an 8E list, and Guard lacks it by themself.

  12. Amir Hayek
    Arabviking January 17, 2018 3:05 pm

    Great episode!
    Please always have a guest on! 😀

  13. Adam Vollrath January 23, 2018 2:04 pm

    Good ep. I didn’t hear Azreal mentioned at all, and I think he’s incredible.