This Week in the ITC: Some Las Vegas Open 2019 FAQs

Hello, fellow Warhammer 40k fans! SaltyJohn from TFG Radio, and one of the Las Vegas Open Head Judges, here to bring you a wrap up of this week in the ITC focusing on some LVO 2019 FAQs.

The LVO is days away at this point! In two weeks many of us will be in Vegas readying ourselves for the events to come. Some will be feasting, others drinking, some gambling, a select few will be allowed into the hallowed halls of the Games Workshop showcase, others still perhaps engaging in the nefarious and eximious happenings of the city where what happens there stays there. No matter your Thursday night activities prior to dreaming of the glories to come on the table tops of the 41st millennium and the laurels to be won in the ITC, one thing is certain. You need to know what the hell is going on. To that end, I am going to post a rundown of everything we’ve posted and gone over, plus some new items that we are being asked, frequently. As a community Warhammer 40k players instantiate an inattentiveness to detail when it comes to events that it boggles the mind given how well many of them can grasp the nuances of a game with 30+ rulebooks. LISTS FOR 40K CHAMPIONSHIPS ARE DUE to BCP THIS FRIDAY JANUARY 25th! In light of that a meme and then we’re off!

LVO Update Announcement – Frontline Gaming
https://www.frontlinegaming.org/2018/12/16/lvo-40k-update/

LVO PSA from the Judges
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcdCf3eDEpM&feature=share

ITC Updated Missions
https://docs.google.com/…/1ltQMdeDqYRXOhvdYT3dtUSji3AI…/edit#

ITC Simplified List Format
https://docs.google.com/…/1Y7MR3eBq9VIZ-YmdJ3oxzZQIJMI…/edit

ITC Code of Conduct
https://docs.google.com/…/1RFhFICnwr15wK0pdUcUnp0uNRn_…/edit

General Guidelines for LVO/ITC Terrain
https://docs.google.com/…/1l6E-871Ob11iY2blqkxrJJzP8wL…/edit

Best Coast Pairings
https://www.bestcoastpairings.com/

So that is all the info we’ve posted so far. Below I added a few highlights from the judges PSA video and a few other questions we’ve been asked frequently.

Terrain:

  • There is a 1.5-page terrain guideline on the web. This will be further explained at the event by terrain rules for each set of ITC terrain posted in groupings around the Hall.

Painting:

  • Wash is a color.
  • The 3 colors on the model MUST BE VISIBLE.
  • Plain flat paint and clear plastic bases both count as based so long as you are consistent.

Conversions:

  • Conversions need to be similar in size and shape, need to be WYSIWYG, and need to be approved via email.
  • Counts-as, like Sisters of Silence as Sisters of Battle, is unacceptable. Models need to be at least somewhat “converted”.

Deadlines:

  • Mandatory list submission by January 25th,  you get a written warning if it isn’t submitted by that day and a possible Yellow Card if you have not uploaded your list after receiving a second written warning. If it isn’t submitted by the beginning of round 1 you receive a Yellow Card.
  • Rules cutoff other than FAQs and errata is January 8th

Rules/Lists/Format/Other FAQs in effect for the LVO:

  • Can’t Dark Matter Crystal and then Warp Time.
  • Ork Index units don’t have DakkaDakkaDakka.
  • Crusaders use beta rules.
  • The Passion works like the Berzerker rule.
  • We are not using the Beta Bolter rules, they came out after the 8th.
  • Disgustingly Resilient isn’t a “save” so Supporting Plate would not work on those wounds.
  • The “end of x phase” is still part of that phase and the phase isn’t considered to have ended until you have moved on to the next phase. Essentially all the “end of x phase” strats and powers can still be used at the end of the phase, in whatever order the player desires so long as you are finished with all other non-end of phase actions.
  • A unit that uses a fight again stratagem at the end of the phase, and engages an enemy unit that did not already fight that phase does allow that enemy unit to fight back before the Fight phase is over.
  • Bolters cannot “count as” Storm Bolters. You need to convert the Bolters in some way to look noticeably different from a standard Bolter.
  • Your Warlord must be marked on your List. Your Warlord Trait and Relic are chosen before each match per the ITC Mission Rules, and thus do not have to be on your list.
  • Chess Clocks will be mandatory after a specific round for all players with a winning record. At which point the clock will be provided. Should any player wish to use a clock, and they can provide their own, then that game will be considered a timed game for ITC Code of Conduct purposes. The opponent does not need to agree to use a clock. Only one player needs to want to use it, and be able to provide one should LVO be unable to.
  • Units summoned, through Daemon Summoning, can come on the board turn 1 and after turn 3. They do trigger effects like Auspex and Forewarning.
  • The Volley Fire stratagem for Mordian Iron Guard in the Astra Militarum codex generates 1 extra shot for each 6 rolled. If you fire a Mortar with this strat in effect each hit roll of 6 generates 1 more shot, not d6 more shots.
  • Regarding the Vexillia Teleport Homer and Vect: 1. The strat is Vect’d not the decision to deploy the unit via deep strike. So if a DE player uses Vect on this strat the Custodes player still deploys the unit via deep strike but without the Strat’s special conditions. You cannot choose to “undeploy” when the Strat is Vect’d as the use of the strat is predicated upon the player already deciding to deploy the unit via Deepstrike. 2.  The Custode player can choose to take the casualties from not being able to fit, or choose to deploy them differently and take no casualties as long as it is legal to do so.
  • Secondary Objectives with an Asterisk next to them do not stack with ANY other Secondaries, not just other asterisked secondaries. The Reaper Secondary is an exception to this.
  • If you choose a unit to be Marked for Death, and that unit has the ability to break up into small parts during the game, you must kill all parts of the original unit to earn points for Marked for Death.
  • The ITC Missions do not use the new deployment sequence. They use the “I go, you go” sequence found in the BRB missions.

I hope this was helpful to you! If you have further questions please email them to contact@frontlinegaming.org we are excited to see you all in just 14 days at the 2019 Las Vegas Open! Please share this article in your team chats, message boards, Facebook groups, Reddit boards etc. We want to reach as many people as possible with this information prior to the LVO, thank you for your efforts!

 

And remember, Frontline Gaming sells gaming products at a discount, every day in their webcart!

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About SaltyJohn

John has been playing Warhammer 40k since the 3rd edition box set with Space Marines, Dark Eldar, and weird green palm trees were in the set. He is currently a 40k Head Judge for the Las Vegas Open, the largest 40k tournament in the world. An avid board gamer, a huge fan of video games, and a guest spot on Geek and Sundry as a "Historian" during an episode of "Game the Game" round out his geek credentials. You can catch "Salty" John on TFG Radio's Twitch Show, and Podcast, as well as find him streaming video games on Twitch on the TFG Radio Twitch page from time to time.

55 Responses to “This Week in the ITC: Some Las Vegas Open 2019 FAQs”

  1. John Parsons January 24, 2019 6:33 am #

    What is the policy for base sizes. AKA if I bought an ork army before the current codex release and they are on smaller bases, do I have to rebase them?

    Asking for a friend 🙂

    • SaltyJohn
      SaltyJohn January 24, 2019 7:11 am #

      You may use the old size bases for this years LVO.

  2. Bigpig January 24, 2019 6:37 am #

    Thanks for the consolidated resource list.

    Can you clarify what is meant by the asterisked secondaries not stacking with ANY secondaries, please, as the wording seems to have implications contrary to the way I’ve known folks to be playing (granted, possibly playing incorrectly)? As an example, does this mean that a unit killed and counting for marked for death/big game does not count as one of the 2 units killed for Butcher’s Bill? If so, how does this affect Reaper? Are the individual models in a unit not counted towards reaper if the unit itself scores points for a “kill a unit” secondary such as marked for death or big game? …or is reaper different because it is counting models, which is not the same as counting units, hence no stacking issue?

    • SaltyJohn
      SaltyJohn January 24, 2019 7:14 am #

      The Reaper is an exception, yes. Otherwise, you’re correct a Marked For Death unit does not count toward Butchers Bill.

      • Sam January 24, 2019 7:46 am #

        Hey John, while you’re at it, does that mean you can’t score First Strike vs something you’ve Marked/BGH’d/etc?

        • SaltyJohn
          SaltyJohn January 24, 2019 9:00 am #

          Indeed you cannot score a point for First Strike, Last Strike, or Slay the Warlord if you’re also scoring points towards an asterisked secondary.

      • Embrace Your Inner Geek January 24, 2019 8:38 am #

        Maybe I’m being stupid here, but there is no Asterix against Butcher’s Bill. So I’ve always played that it did stack e.g. you have Big Game Hunter, you kill a Rhino and a Scout Squad. the Rhino counts for Big Game, and because there is no Asterix against Butcher’s Bill, it can also count along with the Scout Squad as one of your 2 units for BB. If that isn’t right, why is there no Asterix beside Butcher’s Bill?

        • SaltyJohn
          SaltyJohn January 24, 2019 8:46 am #

          You’re precluded from earning points towards Butchers Bill and Big Game Hunter by the Asterisk next to Big Game Hunter. “Secondaries marked with an asterisk may not earn points from more than one secondary mission for destroying any one unit.” That means that a unit that earns points towards Big Game Hunter cannot earn points for another Secondary as that would be “more than one”. Butchers Bill can stack with Old School’s First Strike, Last Strike, and Slay the Warlord.

  3. Andrew G January 24, 2019 7:41 am #

    Just to clarify this bit, since other regions sometimes play it differently:

    Your Warlord must be marked on your List. Your Warlord Trait and Relic are chosen before each match per the ITC Mission Rules, and thus do not have to be on your list.

    So your free relic does not have to be listed on your army list and is not locked, correct?

    • Reecius
      Reecius January 24, 2019 8:20 am #

      No, they don’t. And those aren’t ITC rules per se, just straight out of the BRB.

      • Sam January 24, 2019 9:12 am #

        All of the codexes use the language, “Write down any your characters have on your army roster.” This is similar to the wording on page 214 of the BRB that says “The roster […] must also say which unit in the army will be the army’s Warlord.”

        Wouldn’t that mean the free relic needs to be indicated the same as Warlord? If not, what’s the distinction that I’m missing?

        • Reecius
          Reecius January 24, 2019 9:20 am #

          The same wording is used on the strats that grant you additional Relics and those obviously cannot be used in the list building phase. But yeah, the BRB doesn’t support adding your free relic to your list, that’s just something you all did with NOVA (which is totally fine) but we’ve always gone by the book on this one.

          • Sam January 24, 2019 9:24 am
            #

            Your house your rules obviously, but for the sake of discussion 🙂

            The rulebook doesn’t say a word about relics anywhere, presumably since relics came out with the codices, and the stratagems that add more relics just say “before the game”, and nothing about writing them on your army roster.

          • Reecius
            Reecius January 24, 2019 9:41 am
            #

            You are correct that the BRB doesn’t mention relics it is in the Codices, I just used the term BRB out of habit. The point I was driving at is that there’s nothing supporting adding your free relic to your list. Warlord though, is required to be chosen but the warlord trait is not required to be chosen in advance.

            But, all good so long as we’re all clear coming in to the event =)

  4. PandaSaurusRex January 24, 2019 7:57 am #

    Just curious: why does Reaper stack and not anything else?

    • SaltyJohn
      SaltyJohn January 24, 2019 8:23 am #

      It’s models destroyed across units, rather than whole units. It makes sense to do it that way.

    • Reecius
      Reecius January 24, 2019 8:24 am #

      Reaper is per model not unit. If it didn’t stack (sort of) it wouldn’t function.

      EDIT: Lol, John beat me to it =)

      • SaltyJohn
        SaltyJohn January 24, 2019 8:42 am #

        NINJA SKILLS OVER 9000!

      • abusepuppy January 24, 2019 6:03 pm #

        That being the case, someone raised a question on the FB group with a similar issue, so I’d be curious to hear the answer here.

        Say I choose Marked for Death and Big Game Hunter. My opponent has a unit of three Talos. Can I claim one point each for the first two Talos I destroy for Big Game Hunter (since BGH is per model, not per unit) and then claim a point for Marked once I kill the third one? If not, why would that be different than Reaper?

        • SaltyJohn
          SaltyJohn January 24, 2019 9:03 pm #

          The Reaper is the only exception. The language is being tightened up to reflect this and stop attempts at finding loopholes. Expect it soon.

        • Reecius
          Reecius January 25, 2019 7:33 am #

          As soon as you start counting points on a unit for an asterisked secondary it doesn’t count for any other “kill something” secondary with the exception of Reaper. We’re working on some clarification verbiage.

          Funny how we go all year and only now do these good critiques on clarity come in, lol. Better late than never I suppose.

          • abusepuppy January 25, 2019 8:00 am
            #

            I mean, if you’re looking to update the secondary missions with the start of the new season anyways, I imagine this is as good a time as any…

            But the clarification is appreciated. There’s definitely some of those that I (and a lot of people, I imagine) have been playing wrong. Definitely makes Butcher’s Bill and Marked for Death a bit less of an auto-take.

          • Reecius
            Reecius January 25, 2019 8:23 am
            #

            Yeah, for sure. I would have loved to have had this conversation 11 months ago, lol, but it still is always good to improve and tighten things up.

  5. Dupiello January 24, 2019 8:36 am #

    Starting to get confused. Salty John’s YouTube video (good job on this btw!) states list loaded to BCP should be ETC format; but recent publications are saying the Standard format. I loaded by list in ETC format last night- do I need to redo this?

    • SaltyJohn
      SaltyJohn January 24, 2019 8:59 am #

      I believe I said BCP based their format on ETC. You can of course change it to match, and you should check if you need to based on the BCP published format. They are similar so it shouldn’t be too hard to update.

      • Scott B January 25, 2019 5:52 am #

        No offense, but how do you not know the needed format for the list submission to your event..

        • Reecius
          Reecius January 25, 2019 7:31 am #

          It’s not the judges job to know list submission, plus the system is brand new, they’ve never even gotten to use it before.

          • Scott B January 25, 2019 8:15 am
            #

            So which format is it? ETC or one of the other 2 in the document?

          • Reecius
            Reecius January 25, 2019 8:22 am
            #

            You can use ETC or the simplified version outlined in the video. They both work.

            If you watch that lovely video made to explain how to upload a list, that will help loads.

  6. Scott B January 24, 2019 9:11 am #

    How does first strike work with titanslayer? Since you get a pt for every 8 wounds from a Titanic model. If I down a knight turn 1 do I get 3 titanslayer and first strike? Or only first strike? Since titanslayer doesn’t award pts for destroying the Knight. Only removing wounds from Titanic models, does it get around the doubling up pts?

    • Reecius
      Reecius January 24, 2019 9:38 am #

      That was a bit confusing you are correct, I amended the missions verbiage to reflect it more clearly.

      As soon as you start counting points on Titanslayer, you don’t get other secondary points for the unit that revolve around killing a unit.

      Funny how we went all year and no one brought that up, lol. Glad we cleared it up, though.

      • Scott B January 24, 2019 10:11 am #

        I think it’s because in your example in your the mission pack, 2 secondaries are used that both have asterisks.

        • SaltyJohn
          SaltyJohn January 24, 2019 10:12 am #

          That has been addressed.

          • Scott B January 24, 2019 10:31 am
            #

            Cool. Thank you for the clarifications.

        • Reecius
          Reecius January 24, 2019 11:39 am #

          Yeah, exactly. I changed that to avoid that confusion.

  7. Charlie A. January 24, 2019 9:19 am #

    Thanks for doing a standard list submission method. I’m excited about the prospect of someone analyzing all that juicy data.

  8. Nick Wenker January 24, 2019 9:24 am #

    Very helpful to have it all in one place, thank you!

  9. Codi January 24, 2019 10:05 am #

    “Conversions need to be similar in size and shape, need to be WYSIWYG, and need to be approved via email.”

    Reecius, I listened to your interview on Best in Faction. This is why you are getting sent pictures of conversions that you don’t think should need to be reviewed. Should I send pictures of my conversions or should I not???

    • Reecius
      Reecius January 24, 2019 11:40 am #

      If you’re worried fire it over. Most of the time if it is a reasonable conversion it is no issue. We add in that verbiage for CYA, but if you apply some common sense then you’ll be fine. if you are concerned though, fire over a pic.

  10. Grimgold January 24, 2019 11:12 am #

    To add another question to the pile, there is only one place that mentions redeployment removing persistent effects, and it is specific to redeploys due to stratagems. So for example, RAW says necrons keep MWBD after using the veil of darkness but not for dimensional corridor. Is this the way it will be played at the LVO, or will there be a house rule in effect to make it all redeployment removes persistent effect?

  11. Jason Wolfe January 24, 2019 1:55 pm #

    Does need to be on your list when submitted? Or is it activated at the table like the various +1/+2 relic strategems?

    • Reecius
      Reecius January 24, 2019 5:13 pm #

      Does what need to be on your list?

      • jason wofle January 31, 2019 1:26 pm #

        Formatting Daemons ate my comment!

        Does DEATH VISIONS OF SANGUINIUS need to be on your list when submitted? Or is it activated at the table like the various +1/+2 relic strategems?

        I have heard from a reputable source that the key term in that strategem is MUSTERING. MUSTERING means it needs to be on your list. But the Relic/WLT choice, extra Relic strategems, ‘before the battle’ etc. do not need to be on your list.

  12. winterman January 24, 2019 5:02 pm #

    Regarding the Vexillia Teleport Homer and Vect. It is an interesting ruling considering that strat is used before you decide to deploy a unit. So seems like order of operation, Vect denies the strat, then player then decides whether they still want to deploy units at the end of the phase.

    No dog in the fight, just not how I would have ruled it as a TO.

    • SaltyJohn
      SaltyJohn January 24, 2019 9:15 pm #

      It is not decided before. The stratagems wording is “Use this Stratagem at the end of your Movement Phase. WHEN you set up a teleporting Adeptus Custodes unit at the end of the phase…” Emphasis mine. It is used WHEN you set it up, so the decision to teleport it in is already made, you use it during the process of setting up a unit that is already being teleported onto the table.

  13. rvd1ofakind January 24, 2019 8:14 pm #

    So I’ve heard that it’ll be ruled that teleports(da jump, dmc, veil), not just stratagems like tide, also remove all buffs/debuffs. Is this true?

    If so – Daemon stratagems don’t work on non-daemons but auras and everything else does because only stratagems are mentioned. Here only stratagems that rebuild and redeploy a unit are mentioned too but it also applies to teleports?

    “If you use a Stratagem to remove a model from the battlefield and set it up again, does the model retain any persistent effects (for example, a bonus to one of its characteristics as a result of an ability)?”

    “When a Stratagem from Codex: Chaos Daemons uses the Daemon keyword, can it be used to affect any unit with the Daemon keyword, or only units with the Daemon Faction keyword?”

    Shouldn’t this mean that either only the stratagems remove buffs/debuffs or anything(powers, abilities, stratagems) “daemon” should work only on faction daemons too? Why are these ruling different?

    • Paul Winters January 25, 2019 11:56 am #

      Chaos Daemons are a special case because GW made a knee jerk FAQ to prevent Chaos Marine Daemon keyword units from Denizens of the Warp, like Magnus or Mortarion.

      GW put themselves in the corner because there is both a Faction Keyword and normal Keyword, Daemon. This is a problem because once the game starts Faction Keywords become normal Keywords. Per the Designer’s Commentary.

      “Once the battle has begun, the distinction
      between keywords and Faction keywords no
      longer has any effect – both are used to interact
      with abilities identically. Imagine, then, that
      the Heretic Astartes Detachment contains
      a unit of Possessed (which does not have the
      Daemon Faction keyword, but does have the
      Daemon keyword), and I choose for them to
      replace their keyword
      with Khorne. If the Daemon Detachment
      contained a Herald of Khorne, his ability to ‘add
      1 to the Strength characteristic of all Khorne
      Daemons’ would also apply to the unit of
      Possessed, as they have both the Khorne and
      Daemon keywords.”

  14. Mikkesh January 25, 2019 3:10 am #

    Will the submitted lists be published somewhere before the event starts?

  15. Tyler DeVries January 25, 2019 9:10 am #

    do you have to mark on your list if you are using the death visions stratagem for blood angels or is that picked before the game starts when you are choosing your relics and psy powers?

  16. winterman January 25, 2019 4:18 pm #

    That’s not when the stratagem is declared though. That “when” is for when it has an effect, not when you pay the poinys. You use that stratagem at the end of the phase. Full stop. After using it, then the effect takes place when you deploy. Vect strat specifically says it is used before the effect takes place.

    • SaltyJohn
      SaltyJohn January 27, 2019 8:29 am #

      So which “end of the phase” occurs first? Deep striking the unit or this stratagem? Regardless, the ruling stands as it is for the LVO.

  17. Magiceffect January 28, 2019 12:56 am #

    Hey Salty or Reece,
    My group are exploring ITC. We’ve found the mission packs and the tournament format document. But is there a repository of the latest FAQs for ITC?

    If we had started 2 weeks from now and missed this current post by Salty or this events update (https://www.frontlinegaming.org/2018/12/16/lvo-40k-update/?fbclid=IwAR3RgkpBKlCkp9ChcPe4QkVphcChOHBukQ2Asj7d8VPZx-YVwuOby16Mhes)

    None of the existing information in the ITC section on the website has this information. Maybe I’m missing it or is the plan to make a proper FAQ section to be updated?

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