I Dream of IG…

What’s good fellow gamers?  Mr.MoreTanks here with an article a little more like what RawDogger brings to the table.  I’m going to do a little day dreaming as I’m sadly becoming less and less excited about my arguably my favorite army in the game right now, Guard.

Now, the Guard book is not the oldest or most outdated book, I maintain that it is probably among the top two or three choices for allies for any Imperial army, but my how we have fallen from our place of glory since the grand old days of 5th ed.  I know that we’re hearing rumors about Tau in the too distant future, but even still, I want to dream about my wants and desires; who needs blue hooved space commies?   Below, in no particular order, are some of the things I’d love to see in the next Guard update.

  1. Cheaper Transports. Chimeras and the Taurox are all well and good, but the Guard are all about flooding the board with guns and bodies.  In the ITC, mobility is key, and when your transport costs more than your basic squad, or even a squad with any upgrades that are worth taking, well, we’ve got a problem.  It be great to see Rhinos introduced to the Guard.  They’re so common throughout the Imperium that I frankly have a hard time believing that there aren’t Regiments across the stars utilizing them and dreaming about being Astartes.

  1. Artillery Batteries back. Back in the old 5th book, we had access to Griffons, Medusas, and Colossi.  I loved these things and made up 4 Medusa/Colossus tanks to roll around with.  Then the 7th ed book came a long and stole them from us.  They were my precious, and we wants them back! Stupid fat GWs! YOU RUINS IT! If you happen to be lucky enough to attend an event that allows FW and don’t mind shelling out a limb for an Imperial Armor book, or just downloading a PDF, you’ll be just fine.  Still, it seems just lazy to me.  Oh well, the Wyvern is awesome.

  1. Better priced power weapons. Why the hell is a power axe the same cost for a Guardsmen Sgt as it is for a Space Marine Chapter Master?  These weapons cost WAY too much, and I grudgingly take them because they make the combat blob mean and nasty, but by the time I tack on a melta bomb this very easy to kill Guardsmen is running a pretty hefty bill.  GW seriously needs to take a look at their points for close combat weapons in general, but especially for Guard.


  1. Keep our Orders. Please, please, please, GW, DO NOT TAKE AWAY MY IGNORE COVER!!! Seriously, Ignore Cover lascannons are one of the few things left that can make people afraid of Guard.  In fact, give me some more cool ones.  Give me the option of dig in again for +1 cover save if I can only snap fire next turn, but not be pinned, something like that would be really cool.


  1. More Special Characters. Yarrick and Pask are amazing, and while not every option was worth considering in the 5th ed book, having all of those characters available not only added some fun flavors to armies, but it made sense too.  The Guard is an insanely large military organization, the scope of which is nearly incomprehensible.  It seems fairly obvious that there would be dozens of heroes that the Imperium had made famous across the galaxy through propaganda and by the heroes own personal achievements.

  1. Better Russ rules. Leman Russes are the workhorse of the Guard, but the problem is the rules to Ordnance.  Forcing all other weapons to Snap Fire is a frustrating option.  Russes need a rule that overrides this.  I know that this reason alone is why I never really consider any of the Russes, especially ones with Ordnance weapons.  Plus, it would be super badass to see a Russ with some kind of Grav cannon mounted on the turret.


  1. Formations! Gimmie, gimmie gimmie!  I want a formation where Creed gets tons of extra orders to dish out to dozens of heavy weapon teams.  I want a Russ formation where Pask leads an armored column that can gun apart anything.  I want an unending tide of bodies that recycle when they die! I want more for cheaper!  I want a formation where all of my heavy weapons are free! Something epic and powerful.  I want my cheese.

  1. Cheaper Guardsmen. Before you freak out, think about the costs of most units in the game, think about the power of formations giving out free wargear, transports, and more.  Think about all of that, and then tell me that 50 Guardsmen should cost 250 points.  By the time you give them any meaningful weapons, the costs can be somewhat… too much?  The price of them tends to add up quick.


  1. Psyker Battle Squads. Man I rocked these guys in 6th.  I loved running them with a Primaris to Psychic Shriek something after I had knocked down its leadership with these guys.  All fell before the awesome power of this unit, and it was priced pretty well too!  Come back to me!

  1. Regimental Rules. Orders are all well and good, in fact, they are one of the coolest things about the Guard, but a little more flavor would be nice.  Chapter Tactics are super interesting and most all of them can be justified and used successfully in a tournament setting.  It would be very cool to see something like this either through formations, or some other special rules, maybe even supplements, to capture the diversity and different skills of the many regiments across the galaxy.


I could go on and on in greater detail and make a dream codex until the Squats come home, but for now this wish listing will do.  Am I being too greedy? With the trend of the newer books, I don’t really think so.  What other things would like to see the Guard have?


About Mr.MoreTanks

Lover of gaming, whiskey, steak, poker, and politics. T.O. of the http://tshftopen.com/ and http://cruisehammer.org/ events.

23 Responses to “I Dream of IG…”

  1. Avatar
    Alex D August 30, 2015 2:38 am #

    I would love to see regiment rules. Would love to rock the tanith! Or even a famous armored regiment.

  2. Avatar
    westrider August 30, 2015 5:40 am #

    I really miss the 4th Ed Doctrines system. It needed some cleanup and rebalancing, but it was a great way to give a Guard Army a unique feel.

    I think the basic Guardsman is actually priced about right. But the Vet Sergeant should be an optional upgrade, and a bunch of the upgrades need to be re-priced. Get all those right, and you’re probably knocking 100 Points or more off a full Blob, and bringing my preferred 30-strong blobs down to right around 200 Points with a Commissar or Priest, which feels about right.

    The non-Ordnance Russes are mostly OK, tho the Vanquisher needs the Co-axial Heavy Stubber. The Ordnance Russes definitely need some help, tho. Probably a re-write of the Heavy Vehicle Rule so it ignores the Ordnance penalties entirely, which would help Defilers and Monoliths, too.

    There are reasons for not bringing Rhinos in to the IG, but something cheaper would be great. Actually, both the Chimera and Taurox should probably be 5-10 Points cheaper, but even beyond that, something like an open-topped half-track than can cheaply haul 20 dudes would be cool.

    • Avatar
      abusepuppy August 31, 2015 8:18 am #

      Chimeras were fine at 55pts; the increase to price was a five-years-too-late panic move by GW to “fix” the parking lots of 5th edition.

      I’d rather not see IG get Rhinos, if only to keep the factions more distinct. Making the Taurox more different from the Chimera would be nice, though- they missed a good opportunity to give the faction a cheap-as-chips Trukk-style transport with the Taurox, I think.

      • Avatar
        WestRider September 1, 2015 3:00 am #

        Pretty much the same situation with Chimerae and Razorbacks 😛

        And yeah, I do agree with your comments farther down about Doctrines. Like I said, it would need cleanup and rebalancing, and I don’t actually believe GW’s up to that task.

  3. Avatar
    tag8833 August 30, 2015 6:56 am #

    Rather than straight up Ignores cover, I would prefer that the order changes to -2 to cover save. Ignoring basic game mechanics, especially ones that are far more critical to some armies than others are always going to frustrate players.

    Another mechanic that is frustrating is the priests ability to give reroll saves to imperial deathstars. A reroll is so powerful. Mainly I’d like that ability restricted to IG faction units.

    I don’t think guardsmen are incorrectly costed. Look at other cheap troops like Termagants, Hormagants, or Ork Boyz. However, I agree with you that special weapons are incorrectly costed. If the special weapons were cheaper, then guardsmen would be more useful.

    One thing that IG lack in a big way is mobility. I suggest that “Move, Move, Move” is changed such that it allows a unit to more 12″ instead of 6″ (2D6 pick the highest then double through terrain). That might require a restriction on charging in the same turn, but it would help out so much.

    Transports getting cheaper would help here as well.

    Overall, I’d like IG to be much better, but not necessarily by doubling down on things they do now like unkillable blobs, and gunlines. With better mobility options they could play a more interactive game that is more fun on both sides of the table.

    • Avatar
      abusepuppy August 31, 2015 8:24 am #

      > Look at other cheap troops like Termagants, Hormagants, or Ork Boyz.

      Hormagaunts and Termagaunts are terrible. Boyz are better than Guardsmen in every meaningful way (at least taken in a pure vacuum.) Not a great comparison, overall.

      However, I think 5pts per body is a fine price for Guardsmen- with the ability to get lots of heavies/specials and blob up to protect important squad members, Guardsmen are a lot better than they seem at first glance. Orders also multiply their value significantly.

      Guardsmen SHOULD struggle with mobility- the faction is explicitly a huge, unwieldy machine. They have solutions (transports, tanks, flyers, etc) but part of the army’s theme is that it is supposed to be slow and ponderous. I would argue that with the rise of combat blobs as a main component of the army, IG is quite good at getting into midfield- they just struggle a bit crossing the entirety of the table, which should hardly be surprising.

      • Avatar
        tag August 31, 2015 2:05 pm #

        >Boyz are better than Guardsmen in every meaningful way (at least taken in a >pure vacuum.) Not a great comparison, overall.
        +1 AS, +1 BS, +1 I, +6″ range -1 WS -1 T -1 CC attack +Rapid Fire -Furious Charge.
        It nets out about the same. If we do a mock combat that looks like the following
        10 Slugga choppa boyz vs 9 Guardsmen with a Sargent
        Turn 1; Orks Run, Guardsmen shoot (no rapidfire)
        Turn 2; Orks Shoot, Guardsmen shoot (rapidfire)
        Turn 3; Orks Shoot then Charge, Guardsmen overwatch (rapidfire)
        Odds are 1 or 2 Orks make it out alive. 3 if they Sweep on turn 3. If the Guardsmen get to Rapidfire twice then they win handily (6-8 left). Try it out for yourself a few times.

        So Ork Boyz are slightly better with no upgrades. It is probably appropriate that they cost an extra ppm.

        Now the reason guardsmen get more play at tourneys than Ork Boyz is they have better upgrade options. Ork Boyz need addressed slightly more than Guardsmen, because Guardsmen are more usable, but I think they are a fair comparison.

        • Avatar
          abusepuppy August 31, 2015 2:40 pm #

          No one runs squads of naked Guardsmen or squads of ten Slugga Boyz on foot, though. What you’ll more commonly see is an IG squad with a Lascannon (and maybe something else) and a squad of Boyz with Shootaz and a Rokkit.

          Taken in that context, the Guardsmen are less resilient against most guns (due to T3), worse in a fight (duh), almost identical in shooting (against MEQs they are the same when the Guardsmen are in Rapid fire range), and dependent on an attached character to make their morale passable. They are also essentially the same cost (70 vs 75.)

          What makes the Guardsmen useful is the _rest_ of the codex (like Orders) and the ability to bring a wide array of characters to attach to them and grant special abilities or cast psychic powers. If Ork Boyz were in the IG codex, I’d never take a Platoon again.

          • Avatar
            tag September 1, 2015 9:16 am

            In the current Ork codex, I’ve never seen a squad of boyz with shootaz and a Rokkit outside of very casual games. The current Ork codex makes that a pretty subpar unit.

            I have seen a squad of 10 Guardsmen with a Las Cannon. The reason that works, while the Boyz with a Rokkit don’t is this:

            48″ BS:3, S:9 AP:2 > 24″ BS:2, S8 AP:3. The las cannon can also be buffed via psychics or orders, while the rokkit cannot.

            If you see a competitive Ork list with Boyz it is never shoota boyz. It is either green tide, or the Boyz are being used as a caddy for characters. The vast majority of competitive ork lists eschew boyz all together in favor of Gretchin (cheap) or Warbikers (good).

            Especially now in the age of Scat Bikes, Boyz are just an incredibly noncompetitive unit. Guardsmen are much better.

  4. jy2
    jy2 August 30, 2015 6:58 am #

    If you want cheaper transports (i.e. rhinos) right away, then just bring in the Fleshtearers formation. Now you’ve got a Sanguinary Priest to give your blob ATSKNF + FNP as well as 6 cheap rhinos right away.

  5. jy2
    jy2 August 30, 2015 7:00 am #

    One thing I don’t mind is to have recycling guardsman back. If Chaos renegades can do it, why can’t their Imperial counterparts do it as well?

    • Avatar
      abusepuppy August 31, 2015 8:24 am #

      Yeah, that’s actually a pretty good mechanic to represent the “endless waves of men” tactic IG uses.

  6. Avatar
    Beau August 30, 2015 7:24 am #

    Recycling the guardsman back with some sort of reinforcements order would be great. I really want allies of convenience back with chaos for guard. GW kinda screwed me when I just started them up as my 3rd Nurgle army then switched codex on me a month later and boom CTA allies. Alot of my buddies get pretty whiny about forgeworld, plus I don’t like the way renegades and heretics play… I like orders!

    I have a friend who does great using AM with a lord of war + 1 knight. He usually brings a librarian conclave and wyvern spam too. I mean he’s not going to beat Eldar anytime soon, but he does ok otherwise.

    I think formations seem to be the answer. They are an easy GW fix to bolster units by tacking on rules to overpriced units that need a little somethin somethin. Upgrades to expensive? Copy the mechanicus formation with those free upgrades? Etc. This can actually fix the game really quick… one buddy of mine and I play games where we each get to bring one formation from another codex substituting our codexes units instead (I usually make a CSM Sorcerers conclave which is amazing)

  7. Avatar
    Hotsauceman1 August 30, 2015 8:57 am #

    What I want is pure IG to be good. Not ig plus crazy formations from other codexes to be good. When I build a list. I always find myselfing thinking what allies to make em good.

  8. Avatar
    fluger August 30, 2015 2:13 pm #

    I agree with the bulk of this.

  9. Avatar
    Stevr August 30, 2015 4:08 pm #

    Nice article. I am hoping a little love comes towards IG. They are so fun to play with and provide a unique way to compete in the game.

  10. Avatar
    PrimoFederalist August 31, 2015 2:46 am #

    Mostly agree. I’ll bet they could combine Formations with Regimental Doctrines, but yes, my wish list is:
    -Regimental Doctrines
    -Keep Orders
    -Fix Russes
    -[to a much lesser extent] Fix power weapon pricing

  11. Avatar
    Duz August 31, 2015 7:02 am #

    I wish they’d fix plasma on tanks
    A space marine has a better chance of surviving a plasma cannon over heat than a LR…

  12. Avatar
    Beau August 31, 2015 7:15 am #

    I do think plasma overheat saves should be ap2. It’s plasma… how does the armor protect against it?

    I think all armies power weapons are the same cost, just like melta bombs. If a scout’s power sword is 15 points, and a space marine captain’s power sword, and any CSM power sword, then AM power swords should also be 15 points. I do think if there’s a formation tax with some sort of bonus like all blob sergeants get free power swords then… sure.

    • Avatar
      abusepuppy August 31, 2015 8:28 am #

      Yeah, because Plasma weapons aren’t killing your own dudes often enough. That was clearly the problem everyone was having. (Also, a weapon overheating does not literally mean it explodes and vents plasma all over everything- it makes sense that a focused bolt of energy is more damaging than an accidental, undirected release.)

      >I think all armies power weapons are the same cost, just like melta bombs. If a scout’s power sword is 15 points, and a space marine captain’s power sword, and any CSM power sword, then AM power swords should also be 15 points.

      But that’s exactly his point- those SHOULDN’T all be the same cost. A Guardsman should pay a different cost than a Marine, because the Guardsman’s statline is worse and thus their use of the weapon is worse.

  13. Avatar
    abusepuppy August 31, 2015 8:32 am #

    I don’t think Doctrines are really needed, or wanted, as part of the army- they’re a cute way to customize things, sure, but especially looking back at the 4E era of things I think we can say with confidence that GW would do an awful job of balancing them. One regiment is going to get “always regroup on normal Leadership” and another one is going to get “reroll misses with heavy and special weapons.”

    Formations and detachments are basically the way GW handles most of that sort of thing now, which is probably fine. A “light infantry” formation that gives them Stealth and Scout or something is going to end up being better than them accidentally giving Leman Russes Infiltrate due to a shoddy wording on some rule somewhere.

    The Ordnance rule is just stupid. It fucks over so many vehicles that aren’t good in the first place.

    • Avatar
      Warmaster_GIR September 2, 2015 8:46 am #

      Aww but I miss my old Doctrines. Especially Close Order formation, I liked playing my scifi soldiers with lasers as Napoleonics with muskets.

  14. Avatar
    Warmaster_GIR September 2, 2015 8:40 am #

    I always thought the Guard should have the equivalent to a 3-Ton truck transport, Maybe like
    Armor 10 9 9, 3 HP, open topped , No weapons, 20 model capacity, 20 points. Then it achieves what trucks are supposed to do, which is move infantry foreword into an advantageous position and then bugger off and hide. Also it would be cool to deploy a 20 man blob from a truck rather than just 10 man units.

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